Imho this is the case.
the appartments where cheap compared to todays prices.
the buyouts around 300 PED 
You may claim an estate without having to pay the fee! Estate keeps closed as long you donĀ“t pay, but claiming is possible!
If you check shops, you will find estate deeds for apartments very often. Check the estate terminals of this appartments offered at shops, and you will see that MCbroker is still listed as owner, although the shop owners obviously got the the deeds
IMO you should lose the deed unless you pay the fee for X monthsā¦ and then the estate would be put back on auctionā¦
If there is anyone who canāt do this because they can not log in, they would be able to send a support case about it :wise:
I donĀ“t like the idea of losing my deeds due to inactivity!
I have had a 4 month break lately, I would feel very pissed if my mall shop would have been auctioned in that time, as I paid a lot more for it than its todays value.
Personaly I bought my estates in order to use it. Inactivity may happen, and it is everybodys right to sit on whatever he want to sit on.
Same in RL, nobody could be forced to sell his property, only because he didnĀ“t use his property in a way the comunity think it should be used.
Only thing I agree on, is that deed holder should be visible at estate terminal and not who claimed the estate last.
This would make it possible to contact deed holders directly in order to arange a trade, for those interested in buying this estate.
I vote urban legend about the apartments being all bought by several peopleā¦
Do some math:
7 apartments per floor x 300 ped BO x 20 floors x 5 buildings per city = 200,000 ped at a time when hangers sold for 20k. IF you hoped to get your investment back you would have to bet that there would be a HUGE increase in the number of active participants in the game. I dont think this is where people put their money. Too large of supply, not enough demand when trying to sell.
Now, part of the urban legend could have come from Fera, he did buy out a majority of TI City Platinum at one time and then slowly over the next year or so sold them off at a profit. However this was for the premium apartment building, closest to the tp.
You canĀ“t do that math on existing appartments, you must do the math on appartments left in auction!
The day befor all appartment deeds at auction have been gone, there where ~15 pages of appartment auctions.
20 deeds/page = 300 deeds for sale.
300 * 300 (average buyout!) = 90.000k PED.
If the investor calculates only +100 PED / deed (as he controls the market it should be doable), its a profit of 30k PED.
Buying a hangar that time wasnĀ“t 20k PED
The only hangar at auction back that time was that one south of cape corinth at 35k startbid (worst position for a hangar).
Some salesthreads for hangars at better positins existed and it started from 50k PED up to 100k PED what hangar owners wanted back that days.
It was the time when you could rent out your hangars and hadnĀ“t to fly yourself. Very good investment that time.
Asume you bought a hangar that time for 50k PED a good location for 50k PED.
Average profit / flight around 30-50 PED / flight. Lets do the math with 50 PED.
50k / 50 = 1000 flights to break even.
compared to 30k profit:
80k / 50 = 1600 flights to get the same profit as it could bring the estate deal!
Lets asume you can do 5 flights a day, it needs 320 days fulltime playing 
Selling 1 deed a day to get same profit in less days!
Whats the easy profit here ?
Doing 1600 flights to get 30k or selling 300 estate deeds?
Compared to a lot of work for pilot, the appartment deal doesnĀ“t need more than 5minutes a day to drag another into auction 
Even if there would have been a lot more deeds available that time, it would have been a great deal for those who did it.
BTW I thought about doing that myself, but couldnĀ“t get the money fast enough, someone was smart enough to risk it and had the money at hand.
Gratz to the one who was it
So itās a scam to āinvestā and hope the price goes up due to your(and others) actions?? And about the āprovingā part is that really a problem? and if it is I guess MA would be able to ban that person for violation of EULA āaffect someone elseās gameplayā¦ā
Same here scam scam scam because the prices are higher then you would like it seemā¦
I agree it can be frustrating to just see the broker own things, but I also believe you should be able to have some privacy so if you make it change automatic by the deed make it so you can hide your identity too. (or just show one or two of your names)
So what would that be called, if not theft?
IMO you should lose the deed unless you pay the fee for X monthsā¦ and then the estate would be put back on auctionā¦
That already happensā¦ If an avatar does not log in for x amount of months, ALL ITEMS, INCLUDING DEEDS get TTed basicallyā¦ MA should not have to make deeds special in this regardā¦ Itād be start of a very slipper slopeā¦ next thing you know all armor would have to be worn or if it sits in your storage for x amount of months, itāll disappear since your holding it is keeping someone else in the game from having that exact item as there are only x amount of items in the gameā¦ same for weaponsā¦ Just imagine how many uber weapons that no one can afford to actually use would re-enter the loot pool if such a cruddy idea were implemented, lol.
That is why I said that you would be able to just send a support case about stuff like that? :silly2:
Soā¦ in real life, when apartments are taken from people because they do not pay the rent, that is theft? :scratch2:
This is supposed to be a REAL cash economy we need more flow in estates anyway
It is unless itās written in the contract, which it is in most if not all.
But lets compare to something IRL you own a house 100% and decide not to pay the electric bill, does the state take your house away from you? [SIZE=ā1ā][COLOR=āSilverā](atleast we in Sweden depend on the electric to be able to live in our houses, unless you own some forest with decent m3 and a fireplace that is lol)[/SIZE]
EDIT:
(next post quote)
No, but they take your electricity away from you if you do not pay it, at least in most places, so this is not really a valid arguement
Yes and then you ācantā use it, as it is if you dont pay the fee/claim here.
but agree with you, lets stay on topic
No, but they take your electricity away from you if you do not pay it, at least in most places, so this is not really a valid arguement :rolleyes:
lets just agree to disagree and keep this thread on topic :laugh:
One thing about preventing of losing your items due to inactivity.
For example if you need a new computer in order to play post VU.10 and it will take you a long tome to save up for it. You can contact support to let them know you cant log in and request via support to have the clock reset. this was told to me by support when i expressed such a concern over my inactivity due to computer and gold card issues.
Well, but the fee for appartments and other property isnĀ“t a rent!
Its a maintainance fee, speak something like the bill for electricity.
You donĀ“t pay your bill, electricity is taken away, speak the electric door doesnĀ“t open anymore.
You still keep the appartment as you bought it. Its yours! But is kind of useless as door doesnĀ“t open, without the electricity, untill you pay your electricity bill again.
estates are NOT like real world apartments since you buy the deed and pay a lot more for it than a simply monthly rent payment like you do irl apartmentsā¦
IF MA ever decides that we should loose estates for not paying maint. fee, which Marco keeps erronously calling rent, they should give us a lot of warning ahead of time, and at the very least give us more resettlement boxes to deal with the moving issuesā¦
Additionallyā¦
Since most apartments are purchased for a certain amount, which is usually 300-800 peds or so, if MA is going to introduce this forclosure type of idea, they should consider the original amount paid, even if it was paid to another avatar instead of to them directly as a massive deposit on the placeā¦
so an apartment purchased for 300 peds should have a minimum of 30 months warning before this sort of thing is put in to place since rent for every month is 10 pedsā¦ and 10x30=300ā¦ so itād be like 300 months that was paid as the deposit on the placeā¦ for shops itād be something more like 10k paid up frontā¦ so thatād be 10,000/12=833 months they would need to warn us since that would be how much was paid as the downpayment depositā¦ so thatād be 69 years they would need to warn us about this crazy rule ahead of time!
for that sort of issueā¦ I hope they NEVER implement a stupid rule like that, especially for apartments and other estates that exist nowā¦
If they introduce a new (L) deed system on other planets, and the only up front payment for that is one monthās rent, let themā¦ leave the old deeds alone.
yeah.. the apartments should be considered more like condominiums, instead of apartments.
Apartments you rent from a landlord. condominiums are āapartmentsā that you own outright. As with real life most condominiums usually charge a maintenance fee to pay for things like the grounds keeper, pool guy and other common area expenses.
Unlike in real life though, they donāt initiate foreclosure proceedings if you donāt pay the maintenance fee on calypso.
Shops and Apartments and all estates that require rent fees should be foreclosed and resold to public if maint fees arenāt paid. I think a 1-2 month grace period is fair enough for someone whose either taking a break, or maybe just purchased shop and needs time to set it up.
After that they could easily solve the issue by allowing people to pay rent in advance for months ahead. So far its pretty dumb with all the investment estates being held for purpose of selling at either profit or break evenā¦
Id love to see more booths/shops open or available for sale, atm though some of them are being sold for such high prices that you need a fat wallet to even try to start a venture. Booths are an option of course for a bit less, but a decent booth is still like a couple 1000 ped. Id buy a booth/shop if I could, but the prices Ive seen last I checked would destroy my ability to decorate and stock it. Since being a crafter or anything decent requires decent PED to afford holding inventory of any size.
Yes, just like how MA removes your possibility to access your apartment until you pay again.
You do not pay ārentā for the apartments, you pay āproperty feeā, as in a fee to access it.
You want cheaper shops?
Prices for shops have never been that low than actual.
A lot Mall Shops sold for more than 30k PED some sold above 40k PED.
My own PA Mall shop, bought at 22k PED, and that one was cheapest to get back that days !
Last PA Mall shop, I have seen at auction was far below 20k PED.
I have seen a lot booth that sold for over 10k PED, today a booth sells below 10k PED
Prices of shops drastically decreased.
I donĀ“t want to speak about the reasons, but one reason may be the entropiabuy plattform, that killed shopowners and auctiontraders basis to survive in this universe.
Its totally understandable to me that a lot of shopowners who invested a large amout of PED stopped operating their shop, due to lost income.
Its up to them to sit on the deeds as long they want, without spending 100 PED / month maintainance fee.
Why selling these shops, if you canĀ“t get back the money you originally invested.
As long as I donĀ“t need PED urgently, I will never sell, below what I had to pay.
If shops make less profit than maintainance fee, its logical shut down the shop! As its waste of PED at that moment!
Actually I am trying to get my shop back into business with a shopping event.
I donĀ“t know if it will work yet, but I am optimistic.
Some other plans to keep my shop profitable exist as well, but those will need some time and PED, nothing to talk about yet.
Other shopowners may have given up, but donĀ“t want to sell the shops at this low.
You canĀ“t charge them to sell for a loss, only because you want a cheap shop.
If you want the shops operated and you would like to have one of those closed shops, then you should offer a price that will pay back the original buyers investment.
I think it wonĀ“t be a big problem to get a shop then!
If shops make less profit than maintainance fee, its logical shut down the shop! As its waste of PED at that moment!
EXACTLY! You got the most valid point here. Shops that are not profitable are not worth keeping open! Therefore, I would like to suggest that MA|FPC (hope you are reading this Maro, Frank, etc.) that ALL MAINTAINENCE FEES BE STOPPED forever, or at least for a year or two. That will allow these shops to find their niche markets and become profitable without constantly loosing peds in rent every month, leaving the shop owners depressed and wanting to not keep the place openā¦
The prices of ALL ESTATES in Calypso are about to go down a lot due to estates on other planets.. so why not remove the rent payment on the calypso estates.. You already have a massively unfair rent system in place since hanger owners, booth owners, and house owners donāt have any maint. fee every month, but everyone else does. It would be smarter to make all the places have no rent, and that gives Calypso a little bit of an edge on the market vs other planets. If itās FPCās job to keep Calypso running, this is one small thing you can do to help keep at least some participants here on the first planet.
Maybe my observation was in error butā¦
When the apartments went for sale mostly balcony apartments went quickly. Especially in well placed buildings. As more buildings were added even the balcony deeds stopped selling. I remember 99 pages (estate auction spam:tongue3:) offered and as they expired they were re listed. It became a stagnant market after awhile.
I purchased my current apt for 200 ped second hand and another for my son for 350 ped (an H from Calendar). I thought about getting a larger one for myself and waited to see if any second hand H or better would show up. As the deeds expired they were no longer re-listed, and after a week the only deeds available were previously sold ones. Towards the end of the Calendar offerings it appeared MA was competing with people that wanted to get rid of the apartments due to the maintenance fee.
Anyway, has anyone that is interested in a āMarcus Calendarā estate contacted MA or FPC to inquire about purchasing the deed? I am slightly curious to know if they would sell those at what their original buyouts were.
Yes, i did enquire about this recently.
The reply i got was:
āAll the [estates] that are available you can find them in the Auction. If they are not there they are not for sale, however, as demand and supplies requires it they will be released.ā
Says it all really. :rolleyes: