Whats so wrong about reselling?

Entropia Universe Economy General Economy Discussion
1

Why do people have such a problem with resellers? What do you think every store you go to in real life is?

Unless you are dealing directly with the manufacturer of a product, the item has gone through AT LEAST one sale BEFORE you buy it, and chances are, two or three. The simple fact of the matter is that most manufacturers could not survive selling their products one at a time as patrons came along. By selling in bulk to resellers, the gain the capital that is necessary to keep them in business.

I know that a direct analogy to PE cannot be made from this example. However, there are crafters out there that do not want to waste their time buying tiny amounts of minerals to build up enough to go on a serious run, and if they are willing to pay the mark up a reseller charges, then they are, in effect, paying the reseller to do that tedious task for them. If you’re are mad that someone bought out a piece of armor you needed, get the hell over it. The guy thats going to pay more for the full set the reseller has put together is paying for the service of NOT having to troll the auction for weeks to get the all the pieces of the set. The guy paying a reseller more for a gun, is paying to not have to monitor the auction for days on end, and then babysit an auction so he doesn’t get out bid.

Another thing. Why is it people call it a scam when someone asks a price that is “more than the item is worth”? I put that in quotes because i honestly don’t know what the hell it means. I have a urban stalker. What its “worth” is the 50 ped tt value it has, that i can trow in a TT can have right now. On the open market, it doesn’t have an intrinsic value. Its worth what ever the buyer is willing to pay for it.

I hate to break it to you, but in the Real world (you know, that crazy place where the ceiling is sometimes blue, and sometimes black with little lights?) NOTHING has an intrinsic value. Oh sure, you can say “my car is worth $10K,” but in fact, its only worth that if you can find someone willing to give that much for it. Other wise, its so much scrap metal, cause the grocery store isn’t going to take it to pay for your food, and the electric company wont take it as payment for a bill.

Even paper currency is a polite fiction that makes it easier for us to exchange things of value, without having to barter out each deal on the moment.

Frankly, the best place to see this is in the illegal drug trade. I’ve seen so many people bitch that they got “ripped off” cause they payed X dollars for a drug (generally weed…) and they “should have gotten” Y amount of it. But they are just being stupid. What they are doing is buying form the dealer what ever amount the DEALER thinks is worth X dollars. One dealer might think $50 is enough for ½ ounce, and another might think its worth only ¼th or even 1 ounce.

Anyway, the point is, resellers are donut anything that doesn’t happen in the real world all the goddamn time; and on top of that, very often they are providing a service, and the markup they charge is the prices of that service.

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because most people (including me) believe that resellers push prices of items higher and higher untill u have to deposit insane amounts to get it

example: noob sees reseller selling full pixie (m) for tt+10 noob thinks thats average because noob sees nonreseller selling at tt+7 noob buys and becomes reseller selling that for (what he thinks is high price but not higher then it sells for) and starts selling full pixie (m) for tt+16

cycle repeats and repeats untill PE dies

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[QUOTE=Tyler91]
because most people (including me) believe that resellers push prices of items higher and higher untill u have to deposit insane amounts to get it

example: noob sees reseller selling full pixie (m) for tt+10 noob thinks thats average because noob sees nonreseller selling at tt+7 noob buys and becomes reseller selling that for (what he thinks is high price but not higher then it sells for) and starts selling full pixie (m) for tt+16

cycle repeats and repeats untill PE dies
[/QUOTE]

You forgot a step in that theory…

n00b realizes that noone is buying at tt+16 and is forced to reduce price.

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Problem is, some resllers will put the price so high they become unbuyable. Until you loose your patience and impulsivley buy the item causing huge damage to yourself. I think thats generally why people are angry aswell as them driving prices to unbuyable heights.

5

But at the same time, how many times has it been stated on this board that it’s the buyers who set the prices…not the sellers? If they’re selling something at an overly high price and noone buys it they’re not gunna raise the price (well…at least not if they have half a brain cell).

6

If resellers would sell an item worth tt+5 for tt+50 they would not sell it and so not be resellers.
Its just like the stockmarket : you buy shares when they’re cheap and sell them when they’re worth more.
Suppose you would be in the auction and see a n00b putting 100 molisk teeth for 110% buyout, would you not get it as soon as possible to put it back for the normal 800-1000% into the auction ?
Items are worth the amount what people are willing to pay for it.
If a reseller tries to sell pixie parts for tt+10 they will get it back, loose 1 PED and are forced to put it back again into the auction.

7

Resellers are Ok and needed, naturally some try to manipulate markets.

From the point of view of the occasional non-reseller…
Occasionally I may have cumulated a full pixie set. I can try to sell
them, but I don’t want to stand in PA longer than 5 minutes. So I yell:
“full pixie (M) tt+0” and voila, it is sold within 3 minutes. I am a superb
salesman you see! (Nowadays price is up so I may sell it by tt+2).

Why I sell the stuff so much below the “real value”? Just because selling
close to the market value takes more effort. Other occasional sales are
done with the similar tendency. So if there is a “real value”, it surely
is defined by professional traders. Amateur prices are not “real value”,
they are for getting rid of the items, and possibly getting little more than tt,
and for getting the stuff a “good home”.

8

Buying small amounts of ores/enmatters and sell to crafters for a few % more is a service (trading), buying stuff on auction just to put it in for a higher price is no service it´s reselling and thats what most people including me dont like.
The only thing those people is doing is pushing the prices up, maybe we should make a chart of know auction resellers so people can avoid buying stuff from them, that way we would probably get rid of most of them, of course we need to update the list a few times every week.

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Re-trader scum speaks out! :slight_smile:

Reseller List?

:wink:

10

Toad nailed it.
Nothing more to say about the subject

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[QUOTE=Daemin]
Its worth what ever the buyer is willing to pay for it.
[/QUOTE]

I REALY hate that quote. It’s wrong. the price is NOT what the buyer is willing to pay for it. I said this before, and I’ll say it again. We, the buyers have no choise but to pay your prices, beacuse the resellers stock up on one specific item, then FORCE the ones who need the items to pay their filthy prices. Reselling is not wrong, not at all. But manipulating the market, stocking up on specific items, draining the market and the using that method to force players to pay over price is. Behaviour like it should be punished.

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What E-lite says is the real truth.
Granted yes nobody HAS to buy anything here at any price. The only things in life you HAVE to have are food, drinkable water, and some kinda shelter from the weather. Everything else is voluntary and you dont have to have it.

Pe being a game in some ways and a casino in others nobody has to have anything. Except wey play this game to have fun, there comes a time when certain items will allow you to have more fun than others.
When you get people that come along and buy up all or most of one item for the purposes of cornering the market and then price gouging on top of it all it makes it so alot less people can have the fun they want to have. These people make it so you get 2 choices be bored in pe or take a reaming form a price gouging reseller.
Both choices are not good for PE or the economy of PE over all this is one of the things that makes people quit.

There is nothign wrong with being a reseller if its done fairly there are theones who do it as a service and there is the ones that do it to take advantage.
Nobody has a problem with the one that does it for a service.
Nobody has any problem with the guy who camps PA, TwP and other cities buying up peoples wool, hide, paints, dung, fruit, ores and enmatters in any amounts and sells them in bulk amounts to the guy who wants to skill crafting for a small markup.
The reseller that nobody likes is the resellers that do it to take advantage
These are the ones who try to buy up every item of furnature on auction or all of any one type of material needed to craft popular items.
The people who buy up any nice item that they can find to create an artificial state of scarcity just so they can price gouge anyone who wants that item.

a small amount of people can afford huge markup these people put and may even buy it(though i doubt any of them want to pay that price and are happy about paying that kinda money for somehting that shouldnt cost that much)
There are a great many who can not afford it at all and thier enjoyment of PE is limted by the abuse of these type of resellers.
Thse kind of resellers dont help anyone but themselves.
They dont help me or you except in draining are ped cards making it so we can do less with the limited bugets we have.
They dont help the economy becuase of artificially induced inflation and pricing prosective plaers and depositers out of the game.
They make PE a less fun place for all.
They dont help MA any becuase while they are sitting on thier horde those items arnt being used by anyone and generating decay.
There is evena good chance that the money they get isnt gonna even be put back into the economy by that person hunting/mining/crafting with the profits. instead they likely use it to buy out more items to corner the market on.
These are the kinda resellers that give a bad name and repuation to all the legitimate ones

13

this is discused 100x times already.

in real store in RL u have some guaranties.

in RL u have antimonopol laws.

in RL u cant buy for, example real estate, (law in my country) and ressell it after 2 days. u must wait 1 year or taxes from resseling will be EXTRA hight. its made specialy to prevent speculations which ones take a place in PE auctions - 5 minutes after item was bought by resseller in auction it comes back in auction with oldprice+100/1000 whatever peds. i definetly wanna see some cooldown timer for auction items - 2-3 months its only normal rule, like in RL :slight_smile:

in RL u can lie about “items” quality, ur given information to buyer must be true or u risk to be penaltized (depends from country laws) in many ways.

items and things which ones are hold by ressellers, which ones waiting some mystical price rise, in PE dont make turnoever, its bad for MA and for PE players too. cash must flow to make profit, not stay in pockets. and if more items/peds/whatever will be stuck in resseller pockets, inactive players storages etc - items/peds turnower will be minimized - less turnoever - less profit :slight_smile:

In PE only thing with which one u risk is ur reputation but 90% of resselers have multiple avatars or dont care about rep. thats all. its a reason why this thing stink so much :slight_smile:

i said before and i can say it one more time:
buying some materials in smaller amounts for crafters or finding some item and then charging a litle fee for this service is ok - its trading and pplz who do busines like this are traders. but dont call auction speculants - traders. most of them act in way which ones are against law in RL in most countries. and its showing only how much these pplz can do to get some peds. their morale i mean.

2 Likes
14

[QUOTE=Teranoz]
Suppose you would be in the auction and see a n00b putting 100 molisk teeth for 110% buyout, would you not get it as soon as possible to put it back for the normal 800-1000% into the auction ?
[/QUOTE]
Im sorry but this kind of attitude is part of the problem.

800-1000% IS NOT THE NORMAL PRICE!!!

For the majority of this year the price has hovered around 400-500%. A few VU’s ago MA in their wisdom fecked around with some of the drop rates. This pushed the price of Molisk Tooth/Buttons through the roof. The drop rate is back to what it was before, but the price is being kept artificially higher by resellers. As a tailor i dont even bother buying Molisk from the auction anymore its cheaper for me to hunt them.

To the starter of this thread please refer to the above paragraph as to why resellers are a problem in PE. The market is so small its quite easy manipulate in many cases. Its far worse with armour & weapons.

The Adjusted A&P Series Hero is a good example. Historically it has sold for around TT+1800-2000. Now becuase of resellers the price is TT+3000. Its impossible to bid on one with out manuael (reseller) out bidding you then putting straight back on the market for TT+3000. THIS IS WHAT IS WRONG WITH RESELLERS IN PE!!

15

[QUOTE=e-lite]
I REALY hate that quote. It’s wrong. the price is NOT what the buyer is willing to pay for it. I said this before, and I’ll say it again. We, the buyers have no choise but to pay your prices, beacuse the resellers stock up on one specific item, then FORCE the ones who need the items to pay their filthy prices. Reselling is not wrong, not at all. But manipulating the market, stocking up on specific items, draining the market and the using that method to force players to pay over price is. Behaviour like it should be punished.
[/QUOTE]

resellers, just read what e-lite said, and u will understand the rest of us. period. e-lite + REP

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[QUOTE=Nea]
resellers, just read what e-lite said, and u will understand the rest of us. period. e-lite + REP
[/QUOTE]

True I agree aswell, nice post m8. :wink:

17

Blah Blah Blah. Heard it all before. Blah Blah Blah. Oh, what is this i’ve found at the top of the forum. Hmm, not sure what it is. Maybe if i press it, and choose this option, I could find other threads of the same thing that have been said over and over and over again..

These things have been answered so many times now, that this is starting to get really boring.

P.S. If you didn’t understand what I was pointing too, then why are you even using forums?? :rolleyes:

1 Like
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[QUOTE=Viateslav]
800-1000% IS NOT THE NORMAL PRICE!!!
[/QUOTE]

Do you know what is the normal price???
Just because something had a value in the past doesn’t mean in the present it should have the same value.

[QUOTE=Viateslav]
… fecked around with some of the drop rates. This pushed the price of Molisk Tooth/Buttons through the roof. The drop rate is back to what it was before, but the price is being kept artificially higher by resellers. As a tailor i dont even bother buying Molisk from the auction anymore its cheaper for me to hunt them.
[/QUOTE]

I don’t believe everything is back to normal regarding the drop. But this is just my opinion. You might be right. But even asking 1000% or whatever is the % right now on the Molisk Tooth is nothing that a hunter can profit much. Just because of the small TT value. I’m paying 10 times more PECs, not 10 times more PEDs. (I’m thinking in the Absolute value, not Relative value)

[QUOTE=Viateslav]
The Adjusted A&P Series Hero is a good example. Historically it has sold for around TT+1800-2000. Now becuase of resellers the price is TT+3000. Its impossible to bid on one with out manuael (reseller) out bidding you then putting straight back on the market for TT+3000.
[/QUOTE]

Depends from what point of view you are speaking. If you own an Adj Hero, I think you would be quite happy, that your investement it the past has grown in value. What would you say if you buy now an Adj Hero for its Historical Price ?!?!?!?! of TT+1800 PED and after 3 months it will be only TT+300 PED. Would be happy?

:laugh: Just realised…

When item X DROPS in value, people start bitching around that Mindark nerfed item X. :wise:

When item X GROWS in value, people start bitching around that resselers are inflating the prices of item X to insane values. :wise:

So, what evil suits you better? Mindark or Resselers? :laugh:

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[QUOTE=e-lite]
I REALY hate that quote. It’s wrong. the price is NOT what the buyer is willing to pay for it. I said this before, and I’ll say it again. We, the buyers have no choise but to pay your prices, beacuse the resellers stock up on one specific item, then FORCE the ones who need the items to pay their filthy prices. Reselling is not wrong, not at all. But manipulating the market, stocking up on specific items, draining the market and the using that method to force players to pay over price is. Behaviour like it should be punished.
[/QUOTE]

E-Lite…

The first thing i want to tell you all is that i am NO reseller, and i am NOT supporting them!..I want you all to look on problems from every possible angle!

What do you really think would happen if one reseller stock up 30 ADJ v1 and put them into auc for ~20k?
Do you believe yourself that the buyers will purchase that guns?..well, to me its pure stupidity!..OFCOURSE they wont!.. and those who will are either stupid or rich!
Its always the seller that set the price and the buyer that either accept it or not!..

Speaking of this Adj v1…

1.What would happen if people would have bought them for 20k?..
Answer: That fugly reseller will keep selling them for that price!..What man is causing that price?..The buyer!

2.What would happen if noone buy the Adj v1 for 20k?..
Answer: The reseller will decrease the price of the guns, ofcourse!..if they dont get anything sold - they are no resellers!
What man is causeing the price decrease?..the buyer!

  1. What would happen if the price decrease to 15k and still noone buy the guns?..
    Answer: That fugly reseller will decrease the price, just as before!

  2. What would happen if noone buy the Adj v1 for 15k?..
    Answer: The reseller will decrease the price of the guns, ofcourse!..if they dont get anything sold - they are no resellers!

  3. The prices is SET by the sellers, ofcourse! But the price is payed by the buyers, ofcourse!..So if an item is not worth every penny it costs - dont buy it!..

Imagine that there is ONE sweet-store in a small town with 2k people.
This store has filled their warehouse with sweets they bought from the “manufacturer” for $5/kg.. The price is set to $13/kg…

Do you think that the people of this town would buy sweets there?..Well, some would, but the majority would not!
What about the store then?..do you think it would survive with that huge price?..No..Never…Zip…its gone!.. If noone buys - they will have to low the prices or they are out of the game…that is the way it is!..

So to everyone that is saying “uuh, a reseller has the price of +5k on a ml-35!!..F*king reseller!!..But i guess i will have to buy it because i need it badly”…

My answer: Need it badly!!!..What the heck!..If you dont think the price is okay, then DONT buy it!.. Because if you do - The resellers will stick to that price!..And remember!..you are NEVER forced to buy an item!..this is a virtual reality!..You should be glad that you dont have to buy food for your avatar to make it survive!..

I really think it sounds stupid when people says “I have to buy it”…Noone forces you!

Look at the prices of Mod/imp/adj items!..
Should we blame every single Pre-gold player for the prices of thoose items just because that they are sky-high?..

well, its the same development that is going on with other items , just not at the same value!

This is how the market works, and it bothers me just as much as it bothers you!..
Am i the only one that can see this matter from the perspective of a reseller?..

This is how the market works!

Regards,
Taxita :tongue2:

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Good post Taxita. +rep