When is loot determined? - Answer found?

Entropia Universe Professions Hunting
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A while ago someone asked whether we thought the amount of loot a MOB would yield was calculated when you looted, or when the MOB was “born”.

I’ve been giving this some thought, and it just dawned on me. I remember an incident where Marco was quoted as saying that a specific number of say, HG shots would be required in order to have a MOB yield something big. I can’t seem to find the quote though. This would hint at loot being determined when you loot the carcass.

However, a clearer answer might be in the Arachnaphilia hunt. We brought down a number of Areanatroxes. No globals whatsoever. This does make me inclined to believe that loot IS determined when you click the carcass… That, or we stumbled on a poor part of the spidey-community.

Debate!

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If loot would be determined when mob spawns then peds would be “tied” to mobs that exist. And when server goes down/up there would huge allocation/deallocation of loots every time.

Would make much more sense if loot is determined at the looting moment.

Also as lots of mobs die without looting (gun turrets, drowning) it would just cause unnecessary load to servers to move loots from those mobs to loot pool again.

2 Likes
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Definitely determined at time of looting.

This was indirectly confirmed in a Support Case someone posted :slight_smile:

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[QUOTE=Avery]
Definitely determined at time of looting.

This was indirectly confirmed in a Support Case someone posted :slight_smile:
[/QUOTE]

PE is dynamic?

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From two of my supports:

[Quote=MA]
The loot system is a null system which means that all players who buy ammunitions, distribute the amount between all players after a while.
[/Quote]

and

[Quote=MA]
Unfortunately loot system is a dynamic system. MindArk cannot tell more about it and advise you talkning with another ingame players in PE, getting more experience or visit some communities forums.
[/Quote]

So the lootsystem is a system where money is going in (ammo, repair) and out (loot). When a mob isn’t killed by a hunter, then the money doesn’t go out. Conclusion: The loot is determate at the time of looting.
This also means that when the loot is bad and less people hunt, the loot would be even worse (less input = less output). The time of hunting doesn’t mean a thing. And a noob can get a HoF because of the great input from Ubers. :slight_smile: :rolleyes: :slight_smile:

6

For one, I don’t believe the answers support is giving out. They remain unclear about everything, simply because they don’t want to give away their secret formula.

I suspect loots are implemented at the moment of spawn. Why ? Because the artifacts which have been looted in the past, where looted from 1 very specific mob with a very specific maturity.

When mobs die without being looted, that loot is not lost, but shifted to the next spawning mob.

Implementing this is also dynamic, since the loot is determined at the moment of ‘birth’.

But then again… same kinda goes for loot determined at the moment of looting :wink: Some flag on the server set to give out the artifact. Maybe it’s a combination of both… perhaps items at spawn and peds at loot ?

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I do believe that the special items are inserted in a different way entirely than regular loot. I’m talking about regular loot here. It would still be very easy to plant a specific item on a specific MOB, though.

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I don’t think there is a special way to place a special item as loot. That would mean two times the programming.

I think there is one automated way of dropping loot onto the mob, and a manual one ( that calls the same piece of coding ) that drops the special drops onto the mob.

Part of the answer should be found in the looting of those special loots… the rest will be some automated ( and randomized ) thingie…

If loot is placed at the moment of looting, then probably the player is taken into account as well.

If loot is placed the moment of spawning… loot is player independent and in fact unbiassed and fair

It could also be that loot is placed during spawn, but also somehow checked at loot time… so the player can be taken into account ( now this is a foul one )…

Just made it more difficult :wink:

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[QUOTE=Ardorj]
From two of my supports:

This also means that when the loot is bad and less people hunt, the loot would be even worse (less input = less output). The time of hunting doesn’t mean a thing. And a noob can get a HoF because of the great input from Ubers. :slight_smile: :rolleyes: :slight_smile:
[/QUOTE]

I dont understand this logic. Ok its less in and less out, but there are also less people claiming loot, so the input and output per player would remain the same?

[QUOTE=MA]
The loot system is a null system which means that all players who buy ammunitions, distribute the amount between all players after a while.
[/QUOTE]

can anyone give me more info on what a null system exactly is? And where did MA say this?

Anyway, does it realy matter when the loot es determend? If we find it out, what will we learn from it then? Aside from that, my guess is that its determend at the moment you loot, just somehow makes most sense to me ;).

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[QUOTE=Witte]

can anyone give me more info on what a null system exactly is? And where did MA say this?
[/QUOTE]

A nullsystem is when the output is equal to the input. Result will always be null.

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I think the actions like avg dmg effects loots so they are calculated when your killing and loot is generated on take loot click.

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[QUOTE=kygon]
I think the actions like avg dmg effects loots so they are calculated when your killing and loot is generated on take loot click.
[/QUOTE]

Soo if you kill a mob in fewer shots .. your average is higher and the loot is higher? How does this work for the “finishing shot”? I tend to switch guns to a less powerful weapon to conserve ammo when a mob is nearly dead..

If average damage determines loot.. then maybe I shouldn’t bother…

VV :smiley:

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[QUOTE=Jeroen3219]
If loot is placed at the moment of looting, then probably the player is taken into account as well.

If loot is placed the moment of spawning… loot is player independent and in fact unbiassed and fair

It could also be that loot is placed during spawn, but also somehow checked at loot time… so the player can be taken into account ( now this is a foul one )…

Just made it more difficult :wink:
[/QUOTE]

Let’s just say it doesnt make sense a just arrived noob killing a feffoid and looting - improved fap -. And believe me as a noob it was my biggest wish. but now that im climbing up the ladder i understand it cannot be this way.

People said that equipment and skills determines loot: Well, here is a very probable explanation:

Ex: Lets say an Ambulimax Dominant drops a shadow thigh when its brought down with X shots under Y time by Avatar Z..

A Trigger could be set so when someone meet specific requirements they get the loot.
Ex:
-If 6 or more shots are used, give 2-10ped…
-If 5 shots kill this mob, then give out shadow piece.
Im sure there are a lot more factors in the loot equation then just shots and time spent… but..remember, this is just an example!,

I think you get the point. This also consolidates Marco’s statement that Viagrafalls talked about.

This would make sense in 2 aspects:

-Having the right skills to do maximum average damage allows you to meet certain requirements. Like the kill mob with less shots. - Factor 1

-Having the right weapons allows you to deal effective damage under X time and under X shots. - Factor 2

Meaning: A mob could have a certain ammount of triggers that would respond differently to avatars.

trigger1 = no loot
trigger2 = 2-3 pedder’s
trigger3 = special conditions = uber item

So if the same mob could be killed by different avatars the result would be to give out different loots to each one. Hence, its dynamic and avatar related..

Which i think makes a lot of sense.

Or it could just be random, and some guys are just luckier then others.

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[QUOTE=Vince Vaughn]
Soo if you kill a mob in fewer shots .. your average is higher and the loot is higher? How does this work for the “finishing shot”? I tend to switch guns to a less powerful weapon to conserve ammo when a mob is nearly dead..

If average damage determines loot.. then maybe I shouldn’t bother…

VV :smiley:
[/QUOTE]

finishing shot, Im really not sure about that a friend has a theory about it - if you try and finish as close to the hp left as possible (20hp using 20dmg) for better loot… the problems with loot theories is that as soon as you think you’ve got it sused you get a hof that goes against everything you thot :slight_smile:

my advice is to try not to think about it, enjoy the hunt and kill with style and dont go insane trying to workout the system too much :wink:

1 Like
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I know that also new players loot more than decent loots. I know examples where players loot over 200 peds on their second night ingame…

So maybe loot is in the mob ( at spawn or loot time ), but the amount is determined by some ‘triggers’.

But the system you describe also makes ( some ) sense. Am curious to more opinions :wink: But it still doesn’t offer clarity to whether loot is placed at spawning time or at looting time…

16

[QUOTE=kygon]
finishing shot, Im really not sure about that a friend has a theory about it - if you try and finish as close to the hp left as possible (20hp using 20dmg) for better loot… the problems with loot theories is that as soon as you think you’ve got it sused you get a hof that goes against everything you thot :slight_smile:

my advice is to try not to think about it, enjoy the hunt and kill with style and dont go insane trying to workout the system too much :wink:
[/QUOTE]

So according to your friends theory:
So you should have a range of weapons.. depending on how much HP you think the mob has left, you should use a particular weapon? that’s interesting… and that supports what marco was saying about skill bonuses and using the right item at the right time.

So initially you try and do as high average damage.. in as few shots as possible… as quickly as possible… then when it comes to the “kill shot” you pick a weapon that will only just kill it..

Thats pretty much what I already do.. lol

OK.. I got it.. I’ll tell myself I know how it works then I will hof!!! :wise:

thanks for the advice.

VV

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[QUOTE=Jorael]

Ex: Lets say an Ambulimax Dominant drops a shadow thigh when its brought down with X shots under Y time by Avatar Z..
[/QUOTE]

I wish i knew what Março’s comment said exactly, but my understanding from it was not anything like this. But more something like…

The ambuli dominant will drop shadow if 100k HG ammo was shot at ambuli dominants.

Your system would not really be fair if you ask me. It would remove the random factor from the drop, and would ensure that only ubers or rich kids would get the good stuff.

18

[QUOTE=ViagraFalls]
I wish i knew what Março’s comment said exactly, but my understanding from it was not anything like this. But more something like…

The ambuli dominant will drop shadow if 100k HG ammo was shot at ambuli dominants.

[/QUOTE]

At that specific maturity level or ambul in general?
Are the item drop cycles for each mob’s maturity then? rather than by mob type?

If items do cycle… by the amount of ammo shot at a mob.. then its best to avoid mobs that have just had a good item drop?

Say 70k ammo is spent on a mob.. then you come along.. spend 30k to try and get that item to drop.. you would effectively be profitting off all the hunters before you who shot that 70k.

Hmmm

VV :scratch:

19

I’m almost 100% sure it’s determined the moment you loot a mob.

A couple reasons:
Back in the time when ‘every’ mob used to give loot, some mobs gave as little as 1 pec, but when you killed them in team, you all got 1 pec. As far as I know it has never happened that 5 members of the team didn’t get any loot and only 1 got 1 pec.

Hunting and mining are similar proffesions and work in a very similar way as Marco has stated allready.
Mining deposits are determined you blow the bomb because skills should matter. So hunting loots are determined on the moment of looting probably … :slight_smile:

20

A Roulette Experience - Shaken or Stirred Mr. Bond?

Loot Wheel.

Loot Wheel is lying flat over expansive areas under your feet.

Seperate Loot Wheel for each mob and/or area.

It has loot lying on it at various positions.

It spins at varying speeds.

When you click ‘loot’ your loot window takes a snapshot of the loot lying on the Loot Wheel under you.

Therefore, loot has not much to do with the mob at all.

DD
:evilking: