How mining works (Theory)

Entropia Universe Professions Mining & Resource Gathering
1

Right.
So im sitting here wondering. How come its so hard to find big claims.
I mean. Its un-proportional hard to find a 700 PED HoF in mining than it is in Hunting. Why?
If I were to go out with 2000 PED ammo every day for over a year, id expect to get some HoF’s over 700 PED. Yet in mining you cant be so sure.

I then begun to think over sizes and depth of the mining claims.
We all know that the big mining claims are way deeper than the normal claims.
We also know that we find much more claims that are smaller and thus closer to the surface.
Could it be possible that the bomb works by “digging” its way down in the ground, and when it hits something it reports back to the detonator.
We also know it can only report one find pr claim.
With that in mind we can start wondering why it is so hard to find big claims.
If the detonator only recives the first deposit the bomb finds, and it goes down from the surface.. The first deposits it finds will always be the small ones.
Hence, if you get a deposit near the surface there is a good chance you can actually find something if you bomb the place of your first bomb after you have mined the first claim. The chance are also that this second claim will be bigger than the first one.
One might say, with this information I will be able to completely empty all areas I find.. And I will find all big claims in that area if there are any.
This would be true if the bomb could find claims in a squared fashion.
I, however, think that the bomb works by a elipse function.
At the surface the range is biggest.
The further down you get, the smaller the range on the bomb is.
At say, 100 meters the bomb cant find something more than a couple of meters away from you.
(Prehaps this is where skills matter? - To make the range at those depths bigger)

If you direct your attention to my diagram below you can see my point illustrated.

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/files/2/0/Mining.gif
(Sry for not making a thumbnail, but I think it “needs” to be in the post)

So what do we know now?
Do we know “where to find minerals”? - No, but we have an idea of how to efficiently mine an area once we have found the first claims (If they are near the surface)

Ofcourse, if you find a claim the chances of something below it will decrease the further down you get. Due to two reasons, one being that the area “below” the claim will be smaller than the one you have searched before.. But secondly, the claims there will likely be bigger and thus more scares.

I would really like some input on this theory from the 1337 miners.. (Looking at strakkan / Zefram)

But all in all.. This theory in one line sums up to: If the claim is small and near the surface, bomb again…

Cheers..

7 Likes
2

[QUOTE=Starfinder]
Right.
So im sitting here wondering. How come its so hard to find big claims.
I mean. Its un-proportional hard to find a 700 PED HoF in mining than it is in Hunting. Why?
If I were to go out with 2000 PED ammo every day for over a year, id expect to get some HoF’s over 700 PED. Yet in mining you cant be so sure.

I then begun to think over sizes and depth of the mining claims.
We all know that the big mining claims are way deeper than the normal claims.
We also know that we find much more claims that are smaller and thus closer to the surface.
Could it be possible that the bomb works by “digging” its way down in the ground, and when it hits something it reports back to the detonator.
We also know it can only report one find pr claim.
With that in mind we can start wondering why it is so hard to find big claims.
If the detonator only recives the first deposit the bomb finds, and it goes down from the surface.. The first deposits it finds will always be the small ones.
Hence, if you get a deposit near the surface there is a good chance you can actually find something if you bomb the place of your first bomb after you have mined the first claim. The chance are also that this second claim will be bigger than the first one.
One might say, with this information I will be able to completely empty all areas I find.. And I will find all big claims in that area if there are any.
This would be true if the bomb could find claims in a squared fashion.
I, however, think that the bomb works by a elipse function.
At the surface the range is biggest.
The further down you get, the smaller the range on the bomb is.
At say, 100 meters the bomb cant find something more than a couple of meters away from you.
(Prehaps this is where skills matter? - To make the range at those depths bigger)

If you direct your attention to my diagram below you can see my point illustrated.

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/files/2/0/Mining.gif
(Sry for not making a thumbnail, but I think it “needs” to be in the post)

So what do we know now?
Do we know “where to find minerals”? - No, but we have an idea of how to efficiently mine an area once we have found the first claims (If they are near the surface)

Ofcourse, if you find a claim the chances of something below it will decrease the further down you get. Due to two reasons, one being that the area “below” the claim will be smaller than the one you have searched before.. But secondly, the claims there will likely be bigger and thus more scares.

I would really like some input on this theory from the 1337 miners.. (Looking at strakkan / Zefram)

But all in all.. This theory in one line sums up to: If the claim is small and near the surface, bomb again…

Cheers..
[/QUOTE]

:smoke: its called mineral layers and they do exist… this is the reason why u can mine a place more than once a day and still hit :wink: dont wanna say 2 much but very good post :wink:

3

But all in all.. This theory in one line sums up to: If the claim is small and near the surface, bomb again…

I’d say if the claim is small AND is close to the center of the blast, bomb again at the same spot. If you find a small 45 meters away you will most likely not find anything if you bomb again since any larger deposit must be at 46 meters or more in depth.

However, small deposits seem to come in groups, so if you bomb at the same spot as the small claim, you might find another small one.

Nice post btw. :slight_smile:

4

Nice theory indeed. i’ll try that and (maybe, if i remember) tell result! :slight_smile:

5

Had several deposits(ore)..1-5 mtrs deep i always bombed the same spot..never found anything bigger though…

Could be my skillz.. :frowning:

Well i like this theory anyway so i am gonna keep bombing again the shallow ones… :wink:

Peez..
Ciao a tutti.. :cool:

6

[QUOTE=Darkaner]
I’d say if the claim is small AND is close to the center of the blast, bomb again at the same spot. If you find a small 45 meters away you will most likely not find anything if you bomb again since any larger deposit must be at 46 meters or more in depth.

However, small deposits seem to come in groups, so if you bomb at the same spot as the small claim, you might find another small one.

Nice post btw. :slight_smile:
[/QUOTE]

This is exactly what i do. I thought i mentioned it in another thread. If you get a bomb that goes off thats small and 2 meters bomb the same spot and you will probably get a better hit. I once had a claim that was EXATCLY on the same spot. I had to mine first then drop another bomb and the thing came up exactly the same spot.

Against this theory tho, most (read 98%) of the HoFs (about 8 mining so far) i dropped a mine and hit the HoF. It seems that this theory works great for going from small to average, but from small to vast, i havent seen. Not to say its not true.

Kick ass diagram btw!

Suicide

7

[QUOTE=Darkaner]
If you find a small 45 meters away you will most likely not find anything if you bomb again since any larger deposit must be at 46 meters or more in depth.
QUOTE]

I find in this situation, drop the next bomb where the deposit was found, not where the original bomb was dropped. Chances are you will get another hit.

Suicide

8

well, usually if i did find something with it was small/poor with ~30 distance.
only once i found amble with 5 distance. So let we know :rolleyes:

9

[QUOTE=Darkaner]
I’d say if the claim is small AND is close to the center of the blast, bomb again at the same spot. If you find a small 45 meters away you will most likely not find anything if you bomb again since any larger deposit must be at 46 meters or more in depth.

However, small deposits seem to come in groups, so if you bomb at the same spot as the small claim, you might find another small one.

Nice post btw. :slight_smile:
[/QUOTE]

I must say thanks :slight_smile: worked for me..
I got a small one.. blew another bomb and i got a average :cool:

10

Now Starfinder, What’s Perception mean when you explode a bomb but don’t get a hit? =)

Does it mean you’re within the 50m of the vast? and just need to move around a little more to find it(with a weaker detectonator?)

heh.. something for all the miners to waste bombs on.. err.. I mean, think about.

11

[QUOTE=Dash Smashing]

heh.. something for all the miners to waste bombs on.. err.. I mean, think about.
[/QUOTE]

I think that quote says it all. I have never had any consistant results with the whole “gained perception” thing. I wish it worked like the theory. I just haven’t seen it myself.

Suicide

12

[QUOTE=Dash Smashing]
Now Starfinder, What’s Perception mean when you explode a bomb but don’t get a hit? =)
[/QUOTE]

It means that you have learned to perceive that nothing is there.

1 Like
13

the same question about “What does it mean when you gain aim from shooting up into the air…”…

:smiley:

enough said..

14

[QUOTE=Shade]
It means that you have learned to perceive that nothing is there.
[/QUOTE]

Lol… have some rep for that one!! :smiley:

Suicide

1 Like
15

[QUOTE=Starfinder]
the same question about “What does it mean when you gain aim from shooting up into the air…”…

:smiley:

enough said..
[/QUOTE]

or gaining courage by running away from something :silly2:

16

Very interesting thread, Starfinder ! Rep++ :slight_smile:

Now, only a few questions remain if you are right, and they are mainly skill-based… :wink:

17

The radius im working with at the moment is 48 meters. It has proven very effective when using my “number spiral” theory. The basics of the theory are very simple to understand. It’s an action, reaction type system. Simply put, plant a probe/bomb at x,y , enter the data into an Excel worksheet and it “predicts” using a chaotic math system where the next mining site is. So far its working quite well, over I would say a 70% hitrate with an average deposit size of 3 ped.

Right heres some details as to how it works.

From your “action” location, depending on the time u execute the action, a new site appears nearby. Current research also suggests that the “time cycle” Mindark uses can vary, just like the cycle of hofs.

Imagine if you will points extending from your avatar out, each one 48 meters from another. Each one of these points has a specific time associated with it.

Below is a simple square based grid to give you an idea of what it looks like

678
501
432

Your avatar is 0, and the minutes are arranged around him (numbers 1 thru 8)
The math to create a circular based spiral is on www.numberspiral.com . An interesting side fact on numberspirals is that the “squared numbers” ie 1, 4, 9 etc form a straight “vein” from the centre. This spiral also has the tendancy to rotate, BUT if you really think about it, can be negated through simple chaotic maths. Give it a try it will boost your mining hitrates when you get the values and size of the spiral correct. Mindark’s system is like a living being, it moves, rotates and resizes itself on the fly which is why it will be very difficult to properly figure out.

PS Calypso’s ground plane is FLAT as seen when objects stick at 90 degree angles to mountains and other such elevated objects.

Just a few things to think about
:wise: :dunce: :eek: :confused:

18

So with that theory, you get 70%… last couple of days havent been that good for me… But normally I get 100 - 120% return…

The simple reason why you cant use any “system” to predict where mineral deposits are, is that PE isent a single player game.
As you say your self, action / reaction.. You dont know where all actions have taken place..

Person X in Iticha can, in theory, affect what happens on location X,Y on amethra… There is no way of knowing that… It would be easy to make for MA and virtually impossible for us to “break”…

What I think it the moste compelling “evidence” is that you get 70% with your theory, and I get 100-120% with mine…
Hence, I get almoste double as much return as you.

And I mine using, not math, but a diffrent system…

1 Like
19

[QUOTE=R4tt3xx]
So far its working quite well, over I would say a 70% hitrate with an average deposit size of 3 ped.

[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Starfinder]
What I think it the moste compelling “evidence” is that you get 70% with your theory, and I get 100-120% with mine…

[/QUOTE]

Think he means his hitrate i.e out of every 10 bombs he drops he gets a deposit with 7 of them, not his profit.can’t get a 120% hitrate!!

Easy mistake to make.

1 Like
20

[QUOTE=R4tt3xx]
The radius im working with at the moment is 48 meters. It has proven very effective when using my “number spiral” theory. The basics of the theory are very simple to understand. It’s an action, reaction type system. Simply put, plant a probe/bomb at x,y , enter the data into an Excel worksheet and it “predicts” using a chaotic math system where the next mining site is. So far its working quite well, over I would say a 70% hitrate with an average deposit size of 3 ped.

Right heres some details as to how it works…
[/QUOTE]

thats just like how mobs will regenerate upon the microsecond of death… otherwise, if someone like strakkan were playing, in 30 minutes no more minerals would be left on either continent :laugh: …
but explain to me why the hell you choose 48 metres? mobs regenerate from like 100 metres to past radar range, in my experience… you stick to 48 metres, for whatever reason, and youd never nail the spot.

but, besides that specific reason i dont feel it would work?
i USED this theory. ive used it twice since you posted. it DOESNT work. plain and simple. find your own reasons why, im too lazy to write a page-and-a-half of flaws.